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December 2025

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[Power]

Nobody asked for all hats, but how about one?

Well this will probably make you hate me even more, but... if you didn't idle, you'd have at least one by now. I don't think there is anyone who is stopping idling after he gets his first hat though. Why would they?

[discordance]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUaGWqqaQ5o

[AmS]

Nobody asked for all hats, but how about one?

Well this will probably make you hate me even more, but... if you didn't idle, you'd have at least one by now. I don't think there is anyone who is stopping idling after he gets his first hat though. Why would they?

Well i did, i started idling to get one hat and deleted the idle program after i got it.

[egg]

I havent had a hat from idling or not idling lol

[Power]

Okay I guess I'm always asuming the worst in people. Sorry man.

What I've been bothered by since the introduction of the backpack is that they introduced it without it having a real purpose yet. Without the trading system (which will fail IMO, didn't I write something about it on this board already?) the backpack wasn't really needed and is merely a trashcan to save your dupes in. IMO they should introduce the random drop system, the backpack AND the trading system at the same time, to just make it easy to get an item that you want.

Given the multitude of available items and a relatively low chance of getting a specific one that you want, Valve basically made the same mistake as with the achievements the first/second time around - making them incredibly hard, some almost impossible to get, thus making it easy to justify circumventing this system for people who don't want to wait/work* for it.

Valve really blew it with some achievements for the medic and the requirements for the third milestone on their first try. Heck some achievements I still don't have (one of them I will probably never get - kill 5 people while your ubercharge is ready).

I'm not saying Valve is perfect, infact I can critisize them all day if I need to. This thing was also handled poorly, but in this story the people who gave in to the possibility to circumvent the system have only themselves to blame.

*When I say work, I really mean "play the damn game", though the initial requirements for some achievements very pretty steep.

Edit: also the only hat I have is pyros beany, which is one of the first hats released and I got it in the very first week after the release. Since then I played about a 100 hours I guess, without getting anything else. So am I especially lucky or could I have 20 hats by now if I'd idle to maximize my chances? Statistically it doesn't really matter how many times you roll for a drop if the drop rate stays the same, so would the fact that I get more rolls while idling really benefit my chances? (The answer is probably yes, but the base chance is still the same, so there is the same probability that I would get the same items during normal play).

[CruelCow]

Well this will probably make you hate me even more, but... if you didn't idle, you'd have at least one by now. I don't think there is anyone who is stopping idling after he gets his first hat though. Why would they?

First, I don't hate you at all! I like to banter with you, but that's clearly friendly.

While technically true, I disagree with your argument, but I think we can do this forever without getting anywhere, so how about we agree about the following points:

• Valve could have easily prevented an escalation by simply asking drunken to stop / post on their blog warning people about actions against them, four(!) months ago.
• It was foreseeable that the halo thing would split the community, badly. (And yes it IS a childish community for it.)
• The drop system is a horrible system with a way to low droprate. (Look at my thread, 7 people posted yet and without the program/halo they all got 1 hat. And all of these play a lot of TF2, I'm pretty sure more than average and that in the last 4 months.)

[egg]

perhaps this is why my backpack is the way it is.

Valve removed items if you ganied hats from idling.
Valve gave halo to ppl who never idled.

I have idled but have no hats, so they have taken pity on me, left my weapons, but not given me a halo for trying to idle lmao

[Power]

Well this will probably make you hate me even more, but... if you didn't idle, you'd have at least one by now. I don't think there is anyone who is stopping idling after he gets his first hat though. Why would they?

First, I don't hate you at all! I like to banter with you, but that's clearly friendly.

While technically true, I disagree with your argument, but I think we can do this forever without getting anywhere, so how about we agree about the following points:

• Valve could have easily prevented an escalation by simply asking drunken to stop / post on their blog warning people about actions against them, four(!) months ago.
• It was foreseeable that the halo thing would split the community, badly. (And yes it IS a childish community for it.)
• The drop system is a horrible system with a way to low droprate. (Look at my thread, 7 people posted yet and without the program/halo they all got 1 hat. And all of these play a lot of TF2, I'm pretty sure more than average and that in the last 4 months.)

Agree on all points, but those have nothing to do with being punished and complain about it afterwards as if you did nothing wrong.

1) If drunken f00l would stop or if the idlers would stop after getting the warning in the blog, it would imply that the word from Valve was the first time they got an idea that what they were doing wasn't OK with Valve. I don't see how you wouldn't have even a slightest suspicion, that what you were doing would somehow not be something Valve would want you to do to get those items. I guess you did it, HOPING that Valve is okay with it and asuming so, unless heard otherwise. Which clearly doesn't mean that it actually WAS OK to do.

2) If you ask me, it is only fair to give an item to someone, who didn't do anything wrong as opposed to someone who used an external application to gain some kind of advantage (neglible as it is) in regard to the former group. This is just the complete turnaround on the situation that we had before idlers were punished. One group gets a hat and the other doesn't. If you imply this isn't fair, then the situation before wasn't fair either (and given the idlers probably had more than one hat, more so).

3) If the drop rate is too low depends on how you look at it. I already presented both POV in this thread:
a) the drop rate is really really low, because hats are supposed to be really really rare items - in which case the drop rate was just fine (though it's almost doubled now)
b) I want that hat and I can't get it in a reasonable amount of time (from personal POV) - in which case the drop rate is indeed too low as it failed to stop people to go great length to circumvent it by any means possible

First would mean it's all fine, second would mean, people are just impatient and selfish. I'd agree at drop system being a horrible thing in general though, but for different reasons, probably.

Edit: as I said, greatly enjoying this discussion. Now I'll go to the steampowered forums, because me having faith in humanity is somewhat weird of a feeling. Let's change that.

[discordance]

actually egg they removed all items from idling so people like chaos and mama have about 5 items left. At worst they should have deleted hats from idling but they took everything.

[CruelCow]

I heard rumors you'll get achievement items back "soon". Don't forget your salt!

Anyway I've decided to not take this serious anymore, get some popcorn and watch some internet drama:
http://www.fpsbanana.com/skins/72667
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/HealersAgainstHalos
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/HalosAgainstHAH
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/whatyougetforidling
http://steamcommunity.com/id/lnknprkrocks91
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/HalosBoycott

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/ninetyfivers
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/TheFourPointFive

http://steamcommunity.com/actions/Search?T=ClanAccount&K="halos"

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/HealersAgainstDiscrimination

[discordance]

youre missing the point on halos power, people are taking it too far and being stupid about it. and the halo isnt even that good anyway. its poking fun at people by calling it cheaters lament. They've been punished do they need us all wearing hats called cheaters lament as well?

[Chaos]

I would like you all to note this
This is the state of my backpack
These are my tf2 Achievements

Anything seem funny there? It clearly shows that I have reached every milestone needed to get the unlockable weapons. But I dont have them in my bag.. Good job Valve

[CruelCow]

Well since you clearly used achievement servers, valve took those too
On a more serious note: You probably deleted the achieved ones for higher level random ones.

[discordance]

well the achievements just give an item once, they don't entitle you to have all items of that type. If you deleted the actual weapon you were awarded with for the achievement and replaced it with an idled one their system flagged it for deletion. But I think that was a mistake on valves part. Why delete weapons, noone was idling for weapons (well some were for lvl 100 weapons but who cares). They should have removed only idled hats.

[Twiggeh]

Weapons gained through achivements will be regranted if they were removed