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[Hzza]

it's a good sidegrade tbh

[CruelCow]

Well, the first kill is very hard. And a single (mini)-sentry will completely deny you your first kill.

Even once you have your first kill. You better not failstab. Or kill somebody with your revolver.
Also the disguises are worse, you can't even select the weapon you're holding.


What's the advantage? You instantly redisguise at kills. Right know you can kill somebody in front of his buddy without getting noticed. I expect this to change very soon, since you CAN see it, if you know what to look for.

So yes, while you can have fun like when the dead ringer first got out, I expect it to become completely useless very soon (on wdg).

[CruelCow]

Hats are only cosmetical, right?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPVWpcHTME0

[Brahms]

Surely you get noticed stabbing someone, because there used to be two people, but then there's one? That seems a pretty big give away to me...

[CruelCow]

Well, people are used to having a clearly visible spy to shoot after a stab. If there is no spy, the real teammate won or the spy dead ringered away (until now).
Yesterday I was able to stab 5 people (no chainstab, no cloaking away) on goldrush defense 1st stage, right at the round beginning, since nobody seemed to realize what was going on.

That's why I'm saying I expect it to become a lot less useful.


Also brahms, you missed your leet post!

[Dodgy]

So yes, while you can have fun like when the dead ringer first got out, I expect it to become completely useless very soon (on wdg).

You mean like the dead ringer did?

[Chaos]

the DR isn't useless on WDG. It's just not as stupidly effective as it was when it first came out.

[Dodgy]

That's kinda the point I was making. And the main reason that the dr isn't as effective as when it 1st came out isn't because people got wise to it, it's because valve have been continuously nerfing it since the spy update.

[CruelCow]

But the DR doesn't rely on people not realizing what they see.

[Brahms]

I'm pretty sure they'll add the ability to switch weapons on the disguise.

Also, yeah. It's seldom that you think that a DR spy is actually dead. But he's invisible, so he's hard to find. Once you understand the ER you know that the guy disguised as medic is a spy.

[Junta]

That's kinda the point I was making. And the main reason that the dr isn't as effective as when it 1st came out isn't because people got wise to it, it's because valve have been continuously nerfing it since the spy update.

Can you be specific about what you mean? I do recall DR being more of a pain at first, but don't remember it being nerfed?

[hawt!]

That's kinda the point I was making. And the main reason that the dr isn't as effective as when it 1st came out isn't because people got wise to it, it's because valve have been continuously nerfing it since the spy update.

Can you be specific about what you mean? I do recall DR being more of a pain at first, but don't remember it being nerfed?

DR'er seems to have been buffed imo with the spy set bonus. Literally makes it the same noise as a regular decloak

[CruelCow]

D/R has been nerfed, buffed and rebalanced several times

Most recent (months ago) and severe was that if you extend teh invis period with metal, you lose the perfect invis and damage reduction and you can't recharge it with a single metal pickup by more the 40%.

[Dodgy]

Can you be specific about what you mean? I do recall DR being more of a pain at first, but don't remember it being nerfed?

I believe these are all the nerfs they added (Cruel can correct me if I'm wrong):
First they made it so that you couldn't activate it unless your cloak is fully charged in exchange for letting you pick up metal to charge it. Then they made it so that you were still invisible but no longer 'invincible' when you refilled your cloak with metal while already cloaked. Then they only allowed you to fill your cloak by a certain amount from a single metal pickup, even if it was a full ammo pack. They also increased the sound that de-cloaking made.

Ninja'd by Cruel.

Edit: My initial point was that the strength of the dead ringer was never fooling people into thinking you were dead, and I don't think that the strength of YER is being able to backstab people while their team mates are watching. So I don't think 'people getting wise to it' will help as much as you think.

[CruelCow]

Pretty complete list, but I think they decrased the sound of it.
Also there was the one time where they buggered the recharge and usage rates up when trying to change the c&d.


So what DO you think is the strength of it?