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My CommunityForumPublicTechnicalTopic: CPU's - i5, i7, AMD
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Finaldeath


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« on: September 10, 2009, 12:58:13 PM »

Working my way to getting a new PC, the CPU basically determines the main other non-modular part - the motherboard choice.

So, been reading some info on the new i5's, seem pretty good for games (hyperthreading is always a bit of a server thing more then anything where there are low overhead, but mutli-processor-intensive tasks). These were on slashdot, or linked to on these forums.

Supposedly "turbo mode" is a neat auto-overclocking thing, there is less power consumed then Core 2 Duo's, it's faster too. Of course, compared to i7, there is one less memory thing - so pairs instead of 3's (but this seemingly has no measurable effect!) and hyperthreading is gone, as I mentioned above - but even the real world tests, only lots of little tasks get a massive improvement.

I like how the motherboards almost all do SLI or Crossfire, when I got my current PC it was always one or another.

Anyone got further opinions, pieces and statistics, or other information?

Also, on AMD (to give them some air time) - I never have had one - the PC I first made myself was Pentium 4 for no real reason, and Core 2 Duo when they released them waayyy back. So how do they hold up? what are their latest ones, are there any coming releases, and so on? It's pretty hard to find info on the news pages since there's so much intel stuff right now Sad - the benchmarks put a higher-priced AMD processor in the same (or sometimes less) realm of speed as i5's though.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2009, 01:02:59 PM by Finaldeath » Logged

Finaldeath
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« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2009, 02:58:39 PM »

I've had good experiences with AMD, my first comp (that i built myself) was a K62-500, then an Athlon XP 1700+, Then a Barton 2500+ before going over to Intel for the first time with the Core2 range.
My file server is based around an Athlon X2 x64 3800+

AMD's current offerings are their Phenom 2 range. It's slower clock for clock than Core2 or i5/i7, but you can usually get around the same or better performance for the same money when building a platform.
When tied in with a modern AMD chipset motherboard, they have good windows software overclocking tools, and their Black branded range of CPU's are multiplier unlockedd for easier overclocking.
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discordance


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« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2009, 03:10:57 PM »

I heard AMDs lack a little in reliability but thats just what someones told me i havn't started checking stuff out for myself. except for one youtube video where they fry some chips and the intels just switch off but the amd explodes.

EDIT ah the video is toms hardware from 2001 so no longer relevant. fun to watch though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AQmuUEDxGI

Oh on another point I have had quite a few industrial seminars at my uni where theyd talk about how far ahead intel is in various areas of research.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2009, 03:19:37 PM by discordance » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2009, 05:03:35 PM »

They are just as reliable.
Back in the good 'ol days they diddn't used to come with heatspreaders, whereas the P4's did ... So quite a few people managed to chip the exposed core by being cack-handed when installing the heatsink, which is the source of that rumour.
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Teatime


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« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2009, 08:46:54 PM »

They are just as reliable.
Back in the good 'ol days they diddn't used to come with heatspreaders, whereas the P4's did ... So quite a few people managed to chip the exposed core by being cack-handed when installing the heatsink, which is the source of that rumour.

Well, to my knowledge the video discordance refers to showed the effect of the intel CPU to reduce frequency when getting too hot (e.g. cooler malfunctioned) and survived while AMD - which hadn't that feature at that time - simply overheated and died.
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discordance


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« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2009, 09:04:19 PM »

yeah thats whats happening in the vid. But from what i've heard from semiconducter industry peeps at seminars intel is just so far ahead in stuff like power/temp/emergency whatever other fancy doodads that amd will never catch up, so while chips may appear to be equal in performance specs the intel will probably have a lot of neat little features the amd doesnt.

Apart from emergency handling like in that video though a lot of the stuff won't matter to consumers though.
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Finaldeath


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« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2009, 04:15:02 PM »

Anyone have any reviews or previews of the AMD Phenom 2 range then? I'd not mind AMD if they do have some decent motherboards around - frankly, the i5 P55 motherboards are outrageously expensive for what I'd need, to be honest. Sad (most annoying that!)
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Finaldeath
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« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2009, 12:36:16 PM »

Still have a bit more reading to do, but I guess it will be the i5 for me.
It's a good compromise in performance and probably the right choice to gap the bridge between single-threaded and multi-threaded applications (and it's almost inevitable that the number of those increase, including games).

As for the mainboard I will probably stick to my longtime brand, ASUS. But even then there are more than half a dozen candidates, lol.

PS:
Question: What in the world would I need a third PCIe x16 Slot need for? Are there any cards requiring those?
« Last Edit: September 13, 2009, 12:40:08 PM by Teatime » Logged

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« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2009, 12:52:30 PM »

PS:
Question: What in the world would I need a third PCIe x16 Slot need for? Are there any cards requiring those?

You can have triple SLi setups, or Triple Crossfire (I believe).
You could also use it as with an old nVidia card to use for PhysX.
In the future you could use it with a PCI-E Solid State Drive..
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Chaos
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« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2009, 06:35:34 PM »

you can use a pci-e x1 (thats x16 size) slot for physx.. I been doing that and it works a treat.. got a 9400 and it does the business very well
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« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2009, 03:22:17 AM »

I'm surprised you're actually bothering, PhysX is pretty useless tbh, a propriatory standard is never going to take off - game designers can't incorporate it into the game mechanics and actually do something interesting unless it's going to be available on all machines.
Either it becomes an open standard, or Havok (owned by Intel, but open) / DX11 Compute shaders take over.

Especially since they changed the Win7 drivers so that old nVidia card you stuck in for Physx won't work if you have any ATi cards in your machine. A pretty stupid move IMO.

I get it for free on my 8800GTX, turned it off in the options becasue
a) it causes some issues in Arma2 (which doesn't even use it) and
b) I don't play any games that use it.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2009, 03:25:57 AM by Zarf » Logged

Power


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« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2009, 07:54:03 AM »

PhysX already has a driver similar to havoc. When run with Nvidia, PhysX can (but doesn't have to) offload the physics calculations to a Nvidia card and always runs in software mode (CPU calculation) with an ATi based system.

This is different to the earlier "solution" when only Nvidia cards were able to even start a PhysX based game. Latest example: Trine. Installs a PhysX driver, no matter what graphics card you have and uses PhysX as its only physics engine.

Still largely useless, though, that much is true. There are already cheaper (Havoc, in terms of CPU power) and better (Euphoria) solutions on the market.
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